Lightning Lane & Genie+ Selections ‘Selling Out’ & Holiday Availability
Earlier this holiday week, we shared Genie+ Collapsing in Crowds at Walt Disney World. That detailed the many problems with Lightning Lanes and the paid FastPass service during Thanksgiving week, from technical difficulties to limited ride reservation inventory. This post is essentially the sequel to that, taking a look at ride reservation options every two hours so you have an idea how quickly selections are “selling out.”
We also wanted to supplement that post with additional thoughts based on the ~140 reader comments. Many of those offer firsthand accounts from regular guests who are visiting Walt Disney World right now, and are frankly a bit tough to read. (Not because they’re poorly written–due to the really bad experiences some are sharing.)
Those comments are worth revisiting, especially if you thought we might’ve been exaggerating. Some also cover errors and glitches that we haven’t experienced at all. That’s the bad news–that some people have had even more problems using Genie+ this week than us. The good news is that Lightning Lane inventory hasn’t looked as bad the last couple of days…
To be sure, Slinky Dog Dash is still fully booked within minutes of 7 am. Same goes for Star Wars: Rise of the Resistance on the Individual Lightning Lane side of the ledger. At Magic Kingdom, Jungle Cruise is selling out relatively quickly. The same is true of Na’vi River Journey at Animal Kingdom and Test Track at Epcot.
In order to give you an idea of what inventory is looking like throughout the day, I’ve been taking copious screenshots over the course of the last couple of days–over 200 this week, with 100+ yesterday alone. I’m trying to find a good way of presenting those (I think the 4 in a row below might be too hard to read for most people) and will continue to tweak the approach as this could be a useful illustration going forward.
In any case, I’ve been checking Genie+ regularly and have the following in 2-hour increments (consistent with the 120-minute rule, since that’s the relevant rule when it’s busy). Commentary follows in case you can’t make sense of the screenshots, or just want an interpretation…
~9 am Genie+ Inventory
~11 am Genie+ Inventory
~1 pm Genie+ Inventory
~3 pm Genie+ Inventory
~5 pm Genie+ Inventory
Inventory is definitely better, and it’s better managed. In the prior post, we mentioned that Genie+ Lightning Lane drops or refills had become more frequent and less predictable. That definitely has continued to be the case. In particular, all of the headliners except Slinky Dog Dash had refills after 9 am. All of the Genie+ Lightning Lane selections other than SDD were available at some point after 11 am. (ILLs are a different story–once they’re gone, they’re gone.)
This is relatively significant because it means that, at minimum, you could’ve booked two headliner attractions in any of the parks. Assuming, of course, that you were diligent about watching for watching for Lightning Lane refills and didn’t get a dreaded access code email prompt or have another random glitch while trying to book. (Big assumptions, I know.) Just casually watching from home during another embarrassing Lions loss, I’m pretty confident I could’ve scored selections for at least 4 headliners in Disney’s Hollywood Studios and even more in Magic Kingdom.
Speaking of which, DHS and Magic Kingdom have been our focus with Genie+ since the beginning and that remains the case. It’s a tougher sell for us at Animal Kingdom or Epcot, which is largely driven by a lack of eligible attractions and the reality that following savvy strategy will accomplish just as much. (In the case of Animal Kingdom, “stay late” remains the easiest advice–many Genie+ return times will end up being late in the day when wait times are short anyway!)
Even with this “better” day, inventory at Disney’s Hollywood Studios was pretty low by 3 pm. Still, the Twilight Zone Tower of Terror was available, which would’ve bypassed a 55 minute posted wait and been the 4th Genie+ Lightning Lane selection of the day. That’s not too shabby in terms of total time saved. (That would’ve been the last pick–by 5 pm, even Alien Swirling Saucers was sold out and only shows remained.)
At Magic Kingdom, there were good options into the early evening. Big Thunder Mountain Railroad and the Many Adventures of Winnie the Pooh were still available as of 5 pm. Although I don’t have 7 pm screenshots, there were still reasonably valuable options then. Standby wait times weren’t bad by that hour in the evening, either.
Without question, Magic Kingdom is the best park for Genie+ by virtue of its higher attraction count. This is where the system most resembles MaxPass at Disneyland. Having more attractions also removes some of the pressure, which is part of what makes DHS so stressful and unpleasant for using Genie+ Lightning Lanes.
One of the keys to success with Genie+ is getting a feel for the Lightning Lane selection refills or drops. Sometimes, it only appears that an attraction is ‘sold out’ of Genie+ Lightning Lane times for the day, but is actually just temporarily unavailable. In other cases, the time has progressed into evening, but will soon ‘roll over’ into earlier return times.
Since there’s no modify button (a colossal oversight that urgently needs to be remedied), it’s often advantageous not to book a ride reservation, but rather, to wait for a better time to come along. Cancelling and rebooking is too cumbersome–you’ll usually miss out on the better time, and might get denied a replacement reservation altogether due to the app’s bugginess.
If you’ve yet to visit Walt Disney World, we’d recommend spending some time monitoring the Genie Tip Board in the days prior to your vacation to get a feel for the cadence of refills, when they’re happening, and how quickly the times progress. There’s no good way to explain this via a blog post–learn by seeing/doing.
In the summary of our last post about Genie+ collapsing under crowds, we advised that anyone visiting Walt Disney World this week for “holistic enjoyment” and not just wait time minimization, should opt for a normal rope drop, midday break, late night strategy—and pretend Genie+ doesn’t even exist. If you read the horror stories in the comments, the reasons for that recommendation should be fairly evident. Nevertheless, we want to clarify a bit.
Even with all of these problems, Genie+ can still save you a good amount of time waiting in line–potentially 3+ hours at Disney’s Hollywood Studios and 4+ hours at Magic Kingdom. However, that’s assuming you utilized no other strategy and stood in long lines during the middle of the day. Hopefully, anyone reading a strategy blog like this one would otherwise be leveraging a solid touring plan and tactics for outsmarting the crowds–so the time savings offered by Genie+ is a bit illusory.
Right now, our recommendation (or lack thereof) is more colored by all of the headaches dealing with glitches, screen time trying to score “good” Lightning Lane selections, and who knows what other problems. Don’t underestimate the “cost” of all that, as it is significant right now.
Stated differently, the extra time you spend in line by not using Genie+ might be preferable to the frustrations and time incurred in bypassing some lines. Unless your tolerance for Disney IT induced pain is high, you might come out ahead just doing standby and not messing with it.
Everything has a cost–whether in dollars, time or your sanity. Genie+ takes the first and third, while giving you the second. At this point, that tradeoff is arguably not worth it–except maybe at Magic Kingdom, where it’s lower pressure and there’s greater opportunity to book more selections before they sell out. (If you were already on the fence about Genie due to screen time or dealing with Disney IT, the conclusion here should be an obvious one for you.)
Finally, a friendly reminder to be kind to Cast Members if you’re choosing to visit Walt Disney World during this peak holiday season. This should go without saying and is always the case, but it’s especially true now. It has been a tough couple of years for them, and having to do with the many woes of Genie+ will not be easy or pleasant, especially given how belligerent some guests can be about it.
Frontline Cast Members with whom you interact have literally zero say over Walt Disney World’s prices, the upcharges that get sold, nickel & diming policies–and they certainly aren’t the ones coding My Disney Experience. Lines at Guest Relations and the “blue umbrellas” have been very long this Thanksgiving week, and we’ve heard some horror stories about guest behavior. You are not going to change anything by being rude to them, only reveal the true content of your character. Hopefully we’re preaching to the choir, and everyone reading this already knows that.
As a corollary to this, it’s also worth noting that the decision-makers are often “insulated” from the operational consequences of the products they release and actual on-the-ground guest experience. We already know that the company views Genie as a great success, because CEO Bob Chapek said as much on the last quarterly earnings call. (Money talks…)
He and other leaders see financial results coming out of Walt Disney World, which undoubtedly look great this week, plus summary reports often written to reinforce what they want to hear. It should also go without saying, but those in the c-suite are not in the parks, fielding complaints. They are also not using using Genie+ themselves to book Lightning Lanes because, on the rare occasions that they do visit Walt Disney World, their visits are carefully scripted and they are whisked around by an entourage of park management and have VIP access.
The point of all this rambling is that we recommend respectfully expressing your opinions as to how Genie+ or Lightning Lane is impacting your vacations or business with Walt Disney World by emailing [email protected].
This is far superior to only complaining in comments, social media, forums, etc. (Although Disney sees all of that, too.) Rather than starting petitions, which are largely ineffectual, share feedback in guest satisfaction surveys, bring it up if you speak with managers or others in park leadership, or even contact Guest Relations. Write your letters is a sincere manner, explaining exactly why you were disappointed and the impact it had on your vacation. Sarcasm or “venting” might make you feel better, but it is far less likely to get results.
There’s probably more ground to cover with how Genie+ is working–and breaking–this week at Walt Disney World, but those are my key thoughts in seeing how the last couple of days have played out and seeing reader comments. Should more questions or interesting points arise in the comments, I’ll revise this accordingly. Plus, we’ll be in the parks throughout the weekend and early next week to do more testing and research, and will bring you more firsthand conclusions then. Stay tuned!
Planning a Walt Disney World trip? Learn about hotels on our Walt Disney World Hotels Reviews page. For where to eat, read our Walt Disney World Restaurant Reviews. To save money on tickets or determine which type to buy, read our Tips for Saving Money on Walt Disney World Tickets post. Our What to Pack for Disney Trips post takes a unique look at clever items to take. For what to do and when to do it, our Walt Disney World Ride Guides will help. For comprehensive advice, the best place to start is our Walt Disney World Trip Planning Guide for everything you need to know!
YOUR THOUGHTS
If you’re at Walt Disney World for Thanksgiving week, what has been your experience with Genie+ or standby lines? Any success or failures making morning Lightning Lane selections? Would you recommend Genie+ to others, or just advise sticking to standby? Have you had problems with My Disney Experience glitches, errors or bugs? Other problems or thoughts to share? Do you agree or disagree with my assessment? Any questions we can help you answer? Hearing your feedback–even when you disagree with us–is both interesting to us and helpful to other readers, so please share your thoughts below in the comments!
All this is one of the reasons why we have decided after 2 week vacations every year for 20 years to stop coming to WDW. Money has taken complete control. Paying for parking at the resorts was the first “straw”, no dining plans the second and this fast pass farce the final. Goodbye Disney, at least we have memories of happier times when the magic was still there and the accountants hadn’t taken over!
Great advice. Go with the flow and be grateful in all things that happen. I love positive rather than negative on vacation. Life is too short!
@Ben
It both does and doesn’t affect DAS in some ways. Since they closed the stacking loophole on Genie+ There is a huge glitch. I forgot to scan my daughter in at the second check point at Na’vi and we couldn’t cancel the ride or make another DAS reservation. It took 3 guest services CM to fix. They were told if they booked us another pass and we used it that it would reset the DAS reservation. This doesn’t work. We did it twice. The CM had to pretend she was at Na’vi and check us in for the ride. So don’t do this it’s a headache.
Otherwise you will see in the app a new DAS icon when you log in and go to more. You can have one return time at a time based on standby time not LL availability. Much easier than having to walk up to the attractions. I mean unless you get stuck endlessly on a ride like we did. I suspect that’s why they let the stacking loophole go for so long because of the endlessly trapped glitch it causes.
Can you please tell me how this effects people with DAS? I have pre-registered for the two rides per day per park but will rides not be available for DAS if people have already booked with Genie + early in the morning?
Thank you for any info on this topic.
To whom it may concern
I just returned from a “last minute” 4 days trip from Sunday 11/21 through Thursday 11/25. I am a DVC member but we paid cash for this trip since we used all of our points previously and this was a last minute getaway. I was on the trip with my wife and my three children 16, 14 and 13. I wanted to pass along our feedback on Genie, Genie+ and ILL in particular.
This was the most stressful and exhausting trip we have ever experienced. We have been to Disney dozens of times and this was our worst trip we have ever experienced. The problems with the function of the new Genie+/ILL system showed up before we even arrived and happened to be a sign of the things to come. My first day we were flying and in the air without WiFi when we were eligible to book our second Genie+ selection on Sunday 11/21 at 10am in Magic Kingdom and by the time we landed a lot of the preferred times were taken.
Having to wake up before 7am every morning to book our day was exhausting. We had to have 3 family members up in order to book what we wanted due to several rides “selling out” so quickly. We experienced multiple MDE glitches and we were not able to secure Rise of the Resistance ILL or Flight of Passage ILL on 2 of the mornings, defeating the purpose of getting up so early. The app constantly asked us to log back in and use an email code.
Two of our 4 days we were planning on park hopping (and had dining reservations set up in the second park). I tried to reserve my first Genie+ selection at 7am, had a return time window of 9:50am but when I actually finished booking, the ride return time was 5:40pm. Why can’t the system allow me time to book that reservation instead of pushing me out? This ruined our park hopping plans. I also had another Genie+ selection booked on Tower of Terror for the same time we had dinner booked at Via Napoli. When a more desirable time came up, I cancelled and tried to book the other time and by the time I did it was gone and I lost my Genie+ selection. Why can’t you have a modify button where it holds the reservation while trying to switch?
One of the biggest drawbacks of Genie+ is having to be on my phone all day long. My son kept telling me to put down my phone during our ride on Safari but I had to be refreshing my phone all day in order to try and book a return time that worked for us later in the day when we were park hopping to Epcot.
We love Disney because it’s an escape and relaxing for my family but having to do all the things required to have a good trip made this the most stressful and exhausting trip we have ever been on. I understand that Genie+/ILL is new and things could change but I wanted to make sure you got my feedback that we do not like any aspect the new system to the point where unfortunately, we will not return unless things change. This defeats the purpose of us going.
thanks for the continuing info.
I think that I would rather just wait in the regular lines an not have to play with my phone all day.
Maybe Disney could manage their lines by alternating one party from each while folks are there until they get most of their bugs worked out. Having the paying customers additionally pay for their (what appears to be basic) testing is getting to be too much.
We will be there in mid-January and if we cannot enjoy our trip it will be a long time before we return (even with the our new annual passes and DVC points to use).
Keep up the good works!!!
Can you please tell me how this effects people with DAS? I have pre-registered for the two rides per day per park but will rides not be available for DAS if people have already booked with Genie + early in the morning?
Thank you for any info on this topic.
This reply is for Connie, asking abt being on your phone constantly and taking away from the overall experience, and answer is absolutely YES to all! I’m a younger g’ma with g-kids ages 2-6 and it was extremely frustrating! Lots of rides/experiences were showing unavailable on the MDE app, and with 4 of us on our phones at 7 am and 1pm trying to get on the virtual queue to book Remy Ratat ride it showed ZERO available times for the entire morning and afternoon/evening!!! That angers me to no end, as we paid to get into the park and should be able to get on that ride the same as the privileged few who somehow were able to get it scheduled–AKA “insider trading!!” They have oversold the parks during the holidays, taking away our ability to relax and enjoy the rides and experience overall! Disney has become a greedy cash cow , you even have to pay for the carnival midway games on top of the admission ticket fee. Come on Disney, haven’t you milked enough $$ out of us? My family won’t be returning, after spending 4 days there staying at the Disney resort, spending $15,000!
Hi Jen,
Tom covered the genie+ issues and loophole closures here. https://www.disneytouristblog.com/genie-plus-problems-thanksgiving-crowds-disney-world/
He’s definitely my go to Genie+ source. He’s the also the first (maybe only) blog to even write about the loopholes originally.
Unless I missed it onlong the way. What are the “dreaded access code email prompt” that I see people mentioning?
Thanks, Tom. I saw on a rival blog that the advanced tricks (letting window expire, then riding, etc.) don’t work anymore as of yesterday, can you confirm?
We are at Disney World right now and I have to say, I do resent having to get up at 6:45 to try to book ILL attractions and Genie+. It did work for our Hollywood Studios day on Wednesday, though. I successfully booked Rise, which was our main goal. We actually had a great day and the app worked perfectly for us. The park was crowded as expected, but we were here at Thanksgiving 2019 and I felt it was much more crowded then. This time we could actually find a quiet bench to sit on and rest to have a snack and take in the scenery. Hoping for success at Magic Kingdom – we shall see!
Hi Tom–thanks for your diligent and detailed reporting about this. We have a March trip planned and are already nervous. I appreciate your screenshots of availability, but I wonder if they skew a bit optimistic, since you are (I think?) only looking for single rider availability. We are a family of 4, and plan to do almost all of our rides together. I’m guessing a lot of the frustration people are experiencing on the ground now is from families attempting to get ride reservations at the same time. With the old FP+ system, I would routinely look for in-demand rides, one person at a time, because the old FP system made it easy to “modify” times once you had a FP in place. It seems to me that the new system is much less friendly to users who are attempting to get multiple people on the same ride at the same time, since it is not possible to modify times without cancelling a selection.
These sceenshots are what anyone would see–no party size is specified.
Lightning Lane availability isn’t like ADR or even (cancelled) FastPass+ inventory, where you needed to ‘match’ the party size of the group that cancelled. These refills are just dumping hundreds or thousands of slots at a time, not trying to allocate capacity for each table (or ride vehicle).
Don’t go to Disney genie is not worth it. No decorations no floats only 2 and they call it a parade. No parade that even tries. Need an electric parade Need the magic. There is no magic.
I can report Guest Services was on point yesterday. They did a phenomenal job quickly managing lines and were extra personable.
We did notice something weird by 5 Epcot had pretty well cleared out and waits plummeted. AK also had gotten less busy around 2. I know the suggestion has always been to go early and rope drop but go late and stay late seems like a much more solid plan. Although you will have to be okay with standby lines.
We accomplished a lot more than I thought we would and got walk up reservations (on thanksgiving) for dinner. Our family using Genie+ had to zig zag the park and were exhausted by 5 and couldn’t get a few things like Frozen.
Thanks for sharing your experience!
Thanksgiving is always a bit of an anomaly since people do family dinners and that’s part of why crowds drop later, but late nights being better than rope drop has been true since the parks reopened. I think a big part of it is that stage shows and other entertainment isn’t fully back, so people tend to get burned out earlier.
Hi Tom,
I just wanted to say thanks! We just got back from our first family trip to Disney on Tuesday. I have followed your blog for months since we booked our trip and thanks to your tips and advice, we had an incredible trip! We did have a few hiccups with Genie+, but I followed your advice and we were able to do everything that was on our priority list. We rope dropped Runaway Railway and immediately hit up Tower of Terror and Rockin Rollercoaster and had those done within an hour of park opening. We were able to grab lightning lanes for Slinky Dog, Rise of Resistance, Smugglers Run, and Toy Story Mania. We were at Magic Kingdom on Monday and it was by far the most crowded day. We had planned to rope drop Space Mountain, and after waiting in line at Tomorrowland for an hour, we ran to find the ride was down at opening. We then went to standby line for Peter Pan and Haunted Mansion, booked lightning lanes for Jungle Cruise, Splash Mountain, Big Thunder, and Pirates of the Caribbean. We ended up paying for Mine Train and Space Mountain, but were pumped we fit everything in that we did. Again, thank you! I am still following your blog and we are already talking of when we can make another trip happen!
I keep reading everything about the new system and I feel like I am going to have to be on my phone all the time.
Can anyone tell me if this is true? How often are you looking at your phone to book ride times and do you feel that it is taking away from enjoying your surroundings?
I know I don’t have to use it and wait on standby lines. I was just trying to get honest opinions.
Thank you
I couldn’t purchase a lightning lane at any time during the day. I was not in a resort but should have let me once park opened. I got error that I was ineligible because I was not staying at a resort. This happened in all parks and all hours (I checked constantly).
Thanks for the follow up Tom and I was planning on sharing feedback. While there are many flaws with Genie/ILL I think the major flaws are having to get up every morning before 7am to book, not being able to “hold” your time (SDD genie+ said 9:50 and actually got 5:00pm) and as you mentioned not being able to modify an existing selection.
I have been very frustrated with the Disney App on my iphone the last couple of days. When I click on my day, it just spins. Also in looking at my future plans all plans have been removed with the exception of our hotel reservations.
Makes you want to pull your hair out.