Genie+ Sells Out for First Two Times at Disney World
Despite reaching its record high price, Genie+ has sold out for the day at Walt Disney World for the first time ever. This post shares details about the current crowds, Lightning Lane availability, and our commentary on the paid FastPass service selling out despite the date-based pricing scheme…including why this is a good thing! (Updated February 22, 2023.)
For starters, let’s talk crowds. The first sentence should tells the story there–that Genie+ sold out for the first time ever on February 19, 2023 despite reaching its record high price set last year over Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year’s Eve. Genie+ went from “only” $16 after tax days ago to ~$31 after tax this weekend, just as it did during last year’s holiday season on a handful of occasions.
As with those holidays, this is one of the busiest stretches of the entire year at Walt Disney World. We’ve been warning readers for the last two years–since literally the last time this happened–that this would be the Worst Week of Winter 2023 at Walt Disney World. Nevertheless, it’s still likely catching some people by surprise. Pretty much everyone knows that Thanksgiving, Christmas, and NYE are busy travel times. Fewer are away that Presidents’ Day and Mardi Gras coinciding is a recipe for crowd-tastrophe.
In any case, the price of paid FastPass has jumped to its record high of $29 per person (pre-tax) at Walt Disney World. It reached that the past few days and presumably will remain at that level for at least tomorrow and perhaps most or all of next week. It’s also possible that the price will drop on weekdays after Presidents’ Day, but I highly doubt that given today’s sell out.
If anything, Walt Disney World could be emboldened to increase the price from $31 per person (post-tax) given today’s sell out. After all, they’re leaving money on the table. Some might argue that’s the right move to reach the equilibrium price. (We would not for the reasons explained below, but some might!)
February 22, 2023 Update: In addition to selling out on the Sunday before it, Genie+ also sold out on Presidents’ Day 2023 at Walt Disney World. On Presidents’ Day, it sold out sometime between 1:30 pm and 2:15 pm EST, which was later than it sold out Sunday. Genie+ was once again priced at $29 per person, before tax.
On Tuesday, the price of Genie+ dropped back down to $22 per person (pre-tax) and the paid FastPass service did not sell out. It’s once again $22 on Wednesday, and likewise has not sold out as of 10:30 am.
As a result of this, you might be inclined to assume that Walt Disney World was less busy on Tuesday following the end of the long weekend. However, wait time data actually shows that the opposite is true. Across the entirety of Walt Disney World, the average wait time was 56-57 minutes on Saturday through Monday–the holiday weekend days when Genie+ was $29 per person.
Yesterday, the average wait time across Walt Disney World was 61 minutes. That’s not a huge difference–all of these days are 10/10 crowd levels–but it is going in the wrong direction. That’s not what you’d expect if Genie+ not only did not sell out, but was also cheaper.
There’s no good way to reconcile all of this, but it does reinforce our point made in the commentary below that there’s a certain amount of price inelasticity when it comes to paid line-skipping. Most guests who don’t balk at the $22 price point also are unlikely to be dissuaded from buying the service when it’s priced at $29.
With Mardi Gras break ongoing for some school districts, a runDisney race at the end of this week, and youth sporting events also taking place, expect these 10/10 crowd levels to continue. What’ll be interesting to see is whether there are additional days when Genie+ sells out. The most likely candidates at this point are probably this Friday and Saturday, which are also likely days that Genie+ will cost (at least) $29 per person. It’ll also be interesting to see whether Walt Disney World tests the waters with higher prices.
Attendance should drop sharly starting on Monday (February 27), leading into a relatively quiet start of March 2023 before the spring break crowds arrive in full force a couple weeks later. That’ll be the next big test of Genie+ at Walt Disney World, and it wouldn’t surprise us to see tweaks to the system–perhaps more segmented pricing like tickets (e.g. per park prices or a Park Hopper surcharge) added to Genie+ before then.
Regardless, Genie+ selling out two days in a row shouldn’t be too surprising. This same week last year was one of the year’s 5 busiest, and that was without Mardi Gras coinciding with Presidents’ Day. Certain school districts have all or part of this coming week off, and then there’s the Princess Half Marathon and youth events next weekend, on top of that.
The goal of all these changes is to avoid a repeat of when Genie+ Collapsed in Crowds. A lot has been done since then to better load balance the paid FastPass service. More capacity was added to it via meet & greets and other entertainment, the Genie+ add-on was eliminated, and the date-based pricing scheme was introduced. All of that has helped to varying degrees, and has kept Genie+ from being rendered effectively useless as it was during that collapse. (Although those in the parks today might contest its usability!)
To that point, here’s a look at wait times and Lightning Lane return times at Walt Disney World:
These are not great, but they’re also not awful for a top-tier 10/10 crowd day on the weekend of what will end up being one of the 5 busiest weeks of the year. When it comes to days like today, context is key. Sure, these wait times and those Lightning Lane returns are much, much worse than a random weekday in September. But today is not a random weekday in September.
As compared to some of what we observed between Christmas and Central Florida school districts going back into session last month, this is not awful. Again, not great. But it’s also not as bad as it could be…or even what I expected going into this weekend.
I’ll go one further, sharing my possibly unpopular and controversial opinion: I’m glad Genie+ sold out.
Before grabbing the pitchforks, allow me to explain. In this extremely high crowds scenario, there are only a few options. The first is not letting Genie+ sell out and instead allowing it to become a miserable experience for everyone. Walt Disney World already “experimented” with this approach (see the aforementioned ‘Genie+ crowd collapse’ post). Spoiler: it was awful.
The second option is continuing to raise prices until there’s a corresponding drop in demand. My position on this is well-established, and was laid out back when Walt Disney World first announced demand/date-based pricing for Lightning Lanes.
In a nutshell, my position is that demand for Genie+ is relatively inelastic with incrementally higher prices for the line-skipping service because it’s still a relatively minor cost in the grand scheme of the price of a Walt Disney World vacation. In other words, if you spent $8,000 or more to visit Walt Disney World and were willing to pay peak season prices for hotels and tickets, are you going to balk at paying a few dollars extra to avoid long lines and crowds?
Worse wait times creates a higher incentive for bypassing lines, meaning higher uptake of Genie+ even when it costs more. Demand for beating crowds increases as crowds increase, and as such, Genie+ will always be a relatively small price to pay in the grand scheme of things. Complain as they might, most people will reluctantly fork over the extra money rather than risk a bad trip. They’ve already spent so much–what’s another “few dollars” on top of a multi-thousand dollar trip if it’ll offer a competitive advantage?!
In various ways, we’ve seen all of this play out for years with date-based pricing on everything else at Walt Disney World. Whether it be for park tickets, resorts, or the Genie+ service, date-based pricing is an effective way for the company to accomplish its desired optimizations at Walt Disney World. There are certain times of year that experience higher demand for a number of reasons–school schedules, seasonal events, weather, etc.
Charging incrementally higher prices for these times of year allows Walt Disney World to capitalize on and profit from that inherently higher demand. That’s the goal–not preserving the guest experience or whatever the talking point might be. Increasing prices on that quasi-captive audience is simply savvy business or opportunism, depending upon your perspective. I could go on and on. This already isn’t exactly an “in a nutshell” explanation as promised, so I’ll cut it short. (Sorry, it’s a sore subject for me and I let myself get carried away.)
The final option is letting Genie+ sell out. In light of the above, it should be obvious why this is my preferred course of action. The downside to this is that it’s going to rekindle all of the doom and gloom fears that first cropped up among fans last summer when Walt Disney World added the “subject to availability” disclaimer. Back then, many fans worried that they’d have to be up at midnight to buy Genie+ and then again at 7 am to make their first Lightning Lane reservation.
The last several months have debunked that, but it’s certain to make a reappearance after today. To that, I’d simply point to the time when Genie+ sold out (afternoon!) and the continued low likelihood that it’s going to sell out by 7 am or even before park opening. If that didn’t happen around Christmas or New Year’s Eve (or today!), it probably won’t ever.
I’d also add that, in this case, Walt Disney World did guests a favor by suspending Genie+ sales. Once Lightning Lane availability reaches a certain level, guests should be “protected” from their own worst impulses and desire to waste money on a service that won’t do them much good at all.
When Genie+ sold out today, there were barely any good Lightning Lane options outside of Magic Kingdom. Even there, the return times were (mostly) 120 minutes or more into the future, meaning someone might drop $31 per person to skip 2-3 lines. And that’s the best case scenario in buying Genie+ at 1 pm.
Ultimately, there’s probably no easy fix to this issue for Walt Disney World–no perfect solution that balances supply and demand and keeps everyone happy. That’s why, in my view, Genie+ selling out around noon on busier days is the best-case scenario, and something that, frankly, should happen more often. (This isn’t the first time that buying Genie+ after 11 am would’ve been a complete waste of money!)
It will be interesting to see whether Genie+ selling out for the first time ever leads to increased–and earlier–uptake in the coming days. Personally, I’m skeptical. Almost anyone who was savvy and serious about skipping lines today bought Genie+ hours before it sold out, and the last two days should have been busier than the upcoming week.
Speaking of busy days, if the current crowds caught you by surprise and you’re considering a visit during the next school break, check out our Spring Break 2023 Crowd Calendar for Walt Disney World. If you didn’t see this coming, there’s a good chance you also won’t see the worst of that coming–it’s not just Easter that’s bad. In fact, that won’t even be the worst week of spring break season!
Long-term, the solution to all of this is building more attractions. Queueing is a zero-sum game. No approach to lines–not all standby, not paper FastPass, FastPass+ or Genie–changes capacity. The only meaningful way to alter the equation is by actually increasing capacity. That’s done by adding entertainment, attractions, or extending operating hours. Everything else is a matter of rearranging the deck chairs, and having different guests or demographics come out ahead or behind.
Here’s hoping that Bob Iger actually is serious about wanting to build big park expansions at Walt Disney World and Disneyland–and ones that have more than just a single E-Ticket and upcharge offerings. At the end of the day, capacity-adding additions are precisely what’s needed at Walt Disney World. Some fans salivate at the (fictional) prospect of a 5th gate, but what’s really needed is building out the existing parks so they don’t have this type of issue in the first place. (Despite significantly higher attendance, there’s a reason this isn’t as big of a problem at Magic Kingdom as the other 3 parks!)
If you have questions about the basics of using–or not using–the paid FastPass service, see our Guide to Genie+ at Walt Disney World & Lightning Lane FAQ for all of the foundational need-to-know info. This whole system is confusing and convoluted, so you might have a question or two-dozen. That answers all of the most common ones we’ve been receiving from readers.
Planning a Walt Disney World trip? Learn about hotels on our Walt Disney World Hotels Reviews page. For where to eat, read our Walt Disney World Restaurant Reviews. To save money on tickets or determine which type to buy, read our Tips for Saving Money on Walt Disney World Tickets post. Our What to Pack for Disney Trips post takes a unique look at clever items to take. For what to do and when to do it, our Walt Disney World Ride Guides will help. For comprehensive advice, the best place to start is our Walt Disney World Trip Planning Guide for everything you need to know!
YOUR THOUGHTS
What do you think of Genie+ selling out at Walt Disney World during the weekend of Presidents’ Day and Mardi Gras despite hitting its record high price? Disappointed that it’s happening, or do you see the upside from a lowered demand perspective? Thoughts on our perspective that demand for Genie+ will continue to be highest on the busiest/most expensive days? Any other considerations we failed to take into account or details we missed/got wrong? Will you purchase Genie+ or is $30+ after tax per day too expensive for you? Do you agree or disagree with my assessment? Any questions we can help you answer? Hearing your feedback–even when you disagree with us–is both interesting to us and helpful to other readers, so please share your thoughts below in the comments!
There may be a bit of an effect where increasing price actually increases demand. To a point.
Guest sees the record high price, says, “oh my, the crowds are going to be crazy today, look at how much they are charging for Genie! I better buy it…”
They drop the price to $22, “oh… Disney dropped the price, guess the crowds won’t be as bad today, guess I don’t really need Genie…. ” Throw in, “I paid $29 on Monday and it was nearly useless! I’m not going to be stupid enough to give them more money now, even if they did drop the price to $22!”
I’m very skeptical that the average guest, or even the top 5% of guests, give the interplay between the price of Genie and crowd levels that much thought.
I think your final quote is much more likely to be a real thing many guests did say or feel.
I agree that it’s a good thing to have a cap, but my fear is that, by it selling out, more people will feel like they have to buy genie. I wouldn’t mind paying for fast pass if we were guaranteed at least three reservations and we could plan ahead like the old system.
Our last trip was November 2019, and it was amazing. By reading this blog, I had everything planned perfectly which was a blessing with a two and four year old. My kids will be 5 and 7 in May and I’m really struggling with the inability to plan ahead. I will pay for genie because I feel like I have to. But it feels like such a rip-off compared to what we used to get for “free.” This will likely be our last trip unless Disney actually starts to care about their customers.
Have used the Genie plus but gotten a lot of attractions just by being among the first through these gates. Minutes count. Can’t emphasize this enough! Drag your self out of bed. Dress the little ones while they’re still asleep. Eat breakfast after. Drive a car if you can so you’re not late. Go back to the room and force yourself to take an afternoon nap. See the evening fireworks and then do it all again. Not for the faint hearted
The first Lightning Lane return window is at park open, not early entry, so you don’t have to get the whole family up that early for Genie+. If you want to take advantage of early entry that’s another story.
I’ve heard mixed reviews on Genie+, with the greatest frustrations coming from infrequent/first-time visitors, who probably make up a disproportionate number of the folks who visit during major holidays. I can’t help but wonder if the lower purchase rate later in the week (despite crowds staying high) was because many guests who purchased it on the days it sold out simply didn’t think their money was well-spent.
That’s a definite possibility, and would be consistent with what I’ve heard about guest satisfaction for Genie+ and Lightning Lanes.
I can’t remember if Tom said it here or I read it elsewhere, but I heard that might be a reason Disney stopped pre-selling length of stay Genie+; too many guests wanted their money back on unused days after finding the system lacking.
I think there is a fourth option, which is to not offer Genie+ at all on the busiest days. This would be beneficial to all guests with less total time waiting in line throughout the day. Of course Disney would lose the revenue, but if they really want to put guest experience first, this is probably the preferred solution.
That is a negative Ghost Rider. Any family with little ones under age 5 (mine) will avoid anything over a 60min wait. Between feeding, hydration, potty time, and standing still, any time over 60 is just miserable. That doesn’t leave many options for us on crowded days. Genie+ was a great introduction to curb those complaints about unrealistic wait times for their littlest target audience.
Thank you for your extensive posts on Genie+, how it works and the order you would reserve passes. I am currently at WDW and bought on the two days passes sold out. Because of your advice we have been able to ride all of the headliners in HS, AK and MK. Yesterday in MK, despite 10/10 crowds and sold out capacity on LL, my son and I entered the park at 1 pm and still rode all of the roller coasters, Haunted House, Peter Pan,Winnie the Pooh and a few more rides. By buying at 7 am and making my selections every two hours thereafter, We were still able to ride with only a half day in the park. Thank you for sharing your wisdom so I could make his day magical.
Was at Epcot yesterday without Genie+ and at MK today with Genie+ at rope drop. Had a solid strategy from reading this blog and had a great time. Strangely, Epcot felt busier. Anyways, happy to find this place gets better for me with every visit!
I am very worried that I booked at the wrong time. I have onsite reservations for the week of Easter and this was my dream trip with my adult daughters and my grand children. I can not tell you how much I was looking forward to seeing my grandchildren’s faces when they see Mickey or a Princess for the 1st time as well as watching my adult children acting like kids again going on rides etc. I have spend so, so much money making this trip happen and when I read these posts I am thinking that we will get there and not be able to go on hardly anything and there will be so much disappointment. Oh what did I do and it is too late to cancel and they would be heartbroken anyway.
There will be disappointment and aggravation if the expectation is to “do everything.”
If you go in with realistic expectations and a decent plan, you will have a great time even in super busy crowds. Book a few lighting lanes, plan on taking advantage of early entry or extended evenings. Understand that there will be lines.
Accept that you won’t get to do everything. Accept the compromise between lines and how much you get done. You can make the decision to avoid any lengthy lines, have a fantastic trip, still get in magical experiences and great rides… but leave a lot of experiences on the table. That’s not a bad thing. Your grandkids can have the magic of soaring over London to Neverland and the pirate adventure of Pirates of the Caribbean even if they might not get to do Mine Coaster and Jungle Cruise. The frenetic Toy Story Mania even if they pass up Swirling Saucers.
Realistic expectations and a solid plan, you’ll be fine in the worst crowds. Try to “do it all” without a plan, that’s a recipe for misery.
You will have a great time! Disney, like most things in life, is what you make it. If you go in looking for a magical time, you will find it! We are also going the week of Easter. I’m actually so encouraged to hear that won’t be the worst week of the spring as I had anticipated. We are one of the ones with no scheduling choice. It will be crowded but it will be fun!
I went with my family, which included my in-laws in there early 70’s, two college students, a 5 year-old, and my wife and I over Columbus Day. The parks were very crowded: probably an 8-9, rather than the 10’s you’ll see, but still crowded. We had a fantastic time! All of the adults chose one “must-do” per park, and then we turned the older boys loose to do what they wanted while my wife and I took the little one to do Meet & Greets and rides we thought he’d like. On some days, Grandma and Grandpa took him back to the pool to swim at the resort and the rest of us went and did other things.
There were things that we wanted to do that didn’t happen: I didn’t get one last ride on Splash because the little guy tired out, I missed Everest because I took him to the Dig Site so my wife and the older boys could do it, etc. But, we all made sure that we got to ride the one thing in each park that we really wanted, and the little guy got to do all of the things he wanted.
Go in with a plan, be flexible, and have reasonable expectations, and you’ll still have a great trip! After 4 days in the park, our 5 year-old say that the best thing he did, by far, was ride the Skyliner each day. 🙂
Robin, I echo a lot of the other suggestions, but want to add that my family trick for making sure the littler ones see princesses, mickey, etc. is book character dining. You have to eat anyway and seeing the characters during your meal is so much better than waiting in a huge line at the park for the same mickey. The hour or two waiting to see a character is better spent on a fun ride (or two!) and you can see mickey and friends at Chef Mickeys, Cape May, Hollywood & Vine….you get to take your own pictures and have a decent sit down meal with a server not a crowded counter spot.
Hi Robin, I want to reiterate what others have said in that you can still have a great time even when busy. Brian G in particular has *great* advice. If splitting up for part of the day is an option, go for it. Also I would probably cater what you’re doing to the grandkids’ interests, I suspect everyone else on the trip will have a good time if they see the little ones having a good time. Based on what you’re looking forward to, it sounds like the grandkids are younger and therefore probably don’t have a solid grasp on everything there is to do, which means they’re going to be a lot harder to disappoint. And if they really aren’t feeling something (say a 90 minute wait for a headline attraction), call an audible and do something else. Most Disney meltdowns from any age group (adults get crabby too!) come from people forcing themselves to do something they aren’t in the mood/don’t have the patience for because it was “on the list” rather than taking that break their body is telling them to.
“I’ll go one further, sharing my possibly unpopular and controversial opinion: I’m glad Genie+ sold out. ”
Agreed. There is no perfect line skipping solution.
For anyone who hasn’t seen it and has the patience:
https://youtu.be/9yjZpBq1XBE
Greatest explanation of the history of fastpass and all its warts.
No line skipping system is going to truly give “every” guest a great experience in a 10/10 crowds. Too many people with too little capacity.
Putting caps on the system is the only way to make it an effective system for those that have it. And without totally destroying the theme park experience for those that don’t.
As you discussed, demand is somewhat inelastic so raising prices slightly higher wouldn’t be an effective cap. Though, Universal is a lesson in using a price cap — The add-on price for their system is crazy high. It makes for a fantastic park experience, skipping every line. For today, the Universal Express Pass+ add on price is $275 per ticket. So almost 10x the price of Genie+.
So yes, there is a price point where you can control demand with pricing. But it wouldn’t be going from $29 to $39…. It would be more like going from $29 to $109. (Or go to Universal’s $279 and only a small percentage of guests get the Genie+, but it turns every ride into walk-on).
Point is, it’s good to know that Disney is enforcing an actual cap. I noted that despite 10/10 crowds, there has actually been at least fair G+ availability into the early afternoon.
After a rocky start, I actually think G+ has become a slightly better system than FP+. Not claiming it’s massively better. Both still suffer from the same basic problem — Too much demand for too little capacity. But Genie+ is giving people a *slightly* better chance to get a few premium passes even if they don’t stay onsite, and even if they dont plan 60+ days in advance.
Universal Express does *not* turn every ride into a walk-on. It’s designed to save you about 50% of the standby wait time. I’ve routinely waited 30mins+ in a Universal Express line vs 10-15 mins in Lightning Lane. UEx is a lot simpler to use, however.
I used Universal Express Pass during pre-Covid Presidents Week at Universal. It turned every ride into walk-on. I never had more than a 10-15 minute line at any attraction. This was during holiday crowds.
So I can only speak to my own experience. Only time I waited more than 15 minutes was during early entry when they directed us to the regular line at Gringotts. (Waited about 45 minutes. When done later with EP, it was walk on)
We just arrived home from our vacation, and it was the worse Disney experience since our family of six have been going every other year on Disney vacations since the early 1990’s Tom, I disagree with you that the Genie+ system can be a benefit. it is terrible Let’s lay this out. We paid over $175.00 and selected our first ride. We secured one attraction at 7am for a 10:55 return period. But wait, you have to wait 2 hours after park opening to select another option…. by 11:00 am, our second choice, was not available until 5:30 PM. The we had to wait until 1PM tp pick again… but not available until 8:30 PM. So basically, we went at rope drop, stood in a 2 hour line, then went on the one reservation, and then just waiting in stand by lines because we did not want to be in the park for 12 hours. We paid all this money to skip one line. Very different than the free fastpast system. Very frustrating
Further frustrating was our EPCOT experience. Yes, right at 6:59 Am we were refreshing our apps to get a slot for the Guardians of the Galaxy. No luck. Then , looking like morans, there we were in the middle of the park refreshing our phone again to get into the 1PM slot. Success! But , look at all the time, energy and expense to get a few preferred selections. Our experience at Universal was very positive compared. The kid’s actually thought the Jurassic World VelociCoaster was better than Guardians. Sorry to say, but we are taking a long break from Disney based on our recent experience. it is a shame really as it was always a great family time. We Will return in 2 years when Universal opens new park, and skip Disney altogether. Even my die hard Disney kid’s agreed. Something I never thought I would hear. But you are right… as long as people keep coming back and paying their prices and needing to take graduate level courses to work the reservation system, why would Senior Management .
Sorry you had a bad time, but tbh this sounds like a case of not enough reading of Tom’s articles before your trip. If you had studied a bit, you’d have known that to expect multiple early lightning lanes on a very busy day is not realistic. Instead, the thing to do is rope drop, go standby while waits are low, maybe get in one morning lightning lane, then start stacking lightning lanes for late afternoon/evening, and take a midday break. That’s basic Genie+, and articles to that effect have been out for over a year.
Btw, Guardians uses virtual queue which is separate from Genie+, costs nothing, and works similarly to how it worked in 2019.
We had the exact same experience yesterday at Epcot.-very disappointing. They sold too many Genie Plus LL +, I’m sure they are trying to find the right balance as to when to stop sales since this is a fairly new concept.
Jojo, don’t even comment. I know how to use Genie + LL effectively as we had much success on Saturday.
G+ at Epcot is tough bc there’s just not a lot of rides. On busy days, it’s hard to get more than 1 headliner LL (Remy, Test Track, Frozen) before they sell out. You’re probably better off with early entry than G+ there.
I agree with Ken. I love WDW and have been more times that I can count but you should not need to read numerous blogs for strategic planning of a day or two in an amusement park. Genie + has destroyed the stand by lines and is oversold. It should not even be sold in Epcot, Hollywood or Animal. It’s a waste of money. And yes, all of the parks need 3-4 high capacity continuous load rides.
We were at DHS this past Friday, February 17. They experienced a total meltdown with four of the top rides – SWROTR, Slinky Dog, Tower of Terror and Rockin Rollercoaster all closed at park opening and staying closed for several hours thereafter. Crowds were insane, as predicted, but made even worse because none of the major attractions were available. This made wait times at the usual “walk on” rides rise to 1+ hours. We went to Customer Service and tried to get special permission to park hop to Epcot prior to 2pm. We were refused, with the cast member stating that Disney is completely inflexible on park hopping.
The solution to all of this? Simply stop the greediness that was initiated under Chapek and use the park reservation system to limit crowds to manageable levels.
Spot on! Increasing entertainment capacity would solve it for guests but would Disney give up that easy gravy train? I doubt it. G+ and LL should be more expensive and sell out in half of what is currently available. The higher end demographics already have VIP Service available to them for $2,500. There is too much availability for G+ and LL which is contributing to excessive standby line times. I don’t mind long lines if they’re moving.
I think all rides should be part of the Genie+ system, except for the ones you have to pay extra to ride. Disney shouldn’t say certain rides fall under the Genie+ price and others you just have to use the stand by line and oh, if you want to ride these rides, shell out some more money. We pay a good amount to get into the park and then on top of that you pay for Genie+ and they decide which rides it works for and which ones you just wait in line an hour or more to ride because you can’t use Genie+ on them. I just don’t get it and I have been visiting the Disney parks almost since Disneyland opened. How is this helping the customers have a better experience?
We are at Epcot today and did pretty well without buying Genie+. Took the early early entry and got through Ratatouille and Frozen before 9a.the. Got called to ride Guardians (group 26). So Didn’t get to Test track before epic wait times. But are hitting that up this evening. Had a fun day enjoying some of the Art Festival activities for kids and roamed the countries looking for Figment in famous art (and having more than a few cocktails!). Enjoyed not being tied to my phone looking for lightning lane options. Tomorrow is Animal Kingdom, another early morning, still haven’t decided about Genie+. Thanks for all the advice!!
You’re welcome–thanks for sharing your experience. Glad you’re having a good day at EPCOT and enjoying Festival of the Arts!
Around 8:00 at Epcot, we gave up on the concept of being able to use our G+ LL and waited in line to ride Frozen. The LL line was completely empty!??!!! We asked a couple of cast members how could there be no one in the LL when we see no availability on our app-they that it was an “off” day with the Genie + LL. Those poor cast members looked worn out. I was very nice, but I’m sure others weren’t.
We originally weren’t going to purchase G + LL, but then we saw the higher price because of the capacity, decided to purchase. It again is a circular problem that someone mentioned before. You create more demand with the higher price, but then you oversell.
The greed is evident and will catch up to Disney at some point.
For all the talk about how things like Genie+ and Lightening Lanes are good for guests because they result in “better crowd control” and thus a better guest experience, I cry foul. The bottom line in my opinion is that all they do is anger people and will seriously reduce the number of repeat visits and new long time Disney fans. It’s the classic corporate trade off of short term profits at the expense of long term growth and alienation of loyal customers. I’m one of them. Been going to Disney World regularly (from Seattle!) for over 30 years, but am now booking at Universal, as are my grown children and many of our travel friends. Pent up demand will no doubt keep profits high for quite some time, but when that gets exhausted I think Disney will be in deep trouble. I’m sure the execs at Universal are salivating at the dumbing down and expensing up of the Disney experience.
Has Disney claimed that with regard to Genie+ and Lightning Lanes? I think they’ve claimed regular Genie offers this benefit (it doesn’t) but to my recollection, they’ve only contended that Genie+ and Lightning Lanes offer better “flexibility” while touting how it has increased spending. One reason they’ve been quiet about guest satisfaction since the launch of Genie+ is because, as you suggest, guest satisfaction is down as a direct result of the service.
I still can’t swallow the “Genie+ is only a small cost in the grand scheme of things” mentality. Maybe for a party of 1 or 2, but for a family of 4 or 5, it’s not inconsequential, particularly over a week-long trip. I wish fewer people would buy it … so that it didn’t hold up the standby line you’re going to find me in. Count me in the group that views my trip as one big sunk cost, but that I’m not (usually) in the camp of throwing even more $ at our Disney trip.
Just to be clear, I’m saying that people justify purchasing it because it’s only a small *added* cost in the grand scheme of things–not that it’s a small cost in absolute terms. For a family of 4, this is an additional $70 to $125 per day, and that’s before ILL. That is a lot of money no matter how you slice it, especially for something that was previously free.
What I mean is that, if you’ve already budgeted $8,000 on a trip that includes Genie+ and Lightning Lanes, you’re not going to balk when it turns out to be only a few dollars higher ($31 as opposed to $25, let’s say) upon arrival. The total cost of the trip is so high that most people will begrudgingly pay an extra hundred dollars (or a few hundred, even) over the course of the trip if they think that’ll be a difference-maker.
Not really surprised it sold out but honestly the genie plus doesn’t even make you feel that ahead of the game . The parks are way overcrowded. They should only let a comfortable amount in and charge what is appropriate or there is no value. Personally taking a break from DW till probably 2025 when the new splash opens. In the meantime we are trying Disneyland for first time this summer which I’m sure will also be crowded lol- followed by Disney Paris the following spring.
I would just prefer they figure out how many people can be in the park comfortably, like it was back in the day, and cap it there. Once that number has been reached no one else is allowed in. And they just adjust prices based on demand. It that means it costs $5000 a day to go to disneyworld so be it. They can make the same amount of money as they do now, but the people who do get in will be extremely happy with the experience, instead of everyone getting in and everyone kind of being annoyed about the experience because lines are too long, you dont get special treatment, etc.
For a family of 6, adding genie+ is more than just a few extra dollars, yikes! But we avoid WDW during its busiest times. I honestly don’t mind Genie+ except for the extreme preference it’s given in lines. Last time I was in Orlando we went to EPCOT and watched 50-70 people enter through the LL lanes versus 1 or maybe 2 parties for standby on multiple attractions. That’s a seriously tough pill to swallow. I totally understand that fastpass+ benefitted those who knew how to use it but was frustrating to those who didn’t, but I truly never saw that kind of unequal balance in rides. Genie+ and LL may be good for the park’s revenue but I think it leaves a very sour taste in the mouth of those who feel WDW has become a place for the wealthy. I used to always tell people that no matter where you stayed on property they made you feel so special… that sentiment is lost, and I don’t think it’s coming back. I still love the parks, but definitely not the way I did even 5 years ago.
Oh- and I totally agree that building more attractions is the answer to capacity issues! Unfortunately, I think the last earnings called showed they’re cutting the park budget, so we probably won’t see anything in the near future (after tron)
“I used to always tell people that no matter where you stayed on property they made you feel so special… that sentiment is lost, and I don’t think it’s coming back.”
Can’t disagree with this.
With that said, I don’t think they’re doing a particularly good job of making anyone feel special right now. Some of the on-site benefits have returned and there’s Extended Evening Hours for Deluxe Resort guests, but there’s also a pervasive sense of nickel & diming that makes you feel less like a “guest” and more like a “consumer” no matter where you stay.
IMO, it’s not so much a middle class v. wealthy thing, it’s a ‘maximize per guest spending at all costs’ sense that just about everyone feels. And it doesn’t feel great!
The “merge ratio” of LL:standby you describe is the same as what it used to be under FP+. It’s addressed in detail in the Defunctland Fastpass video on YouTube. The difference today is people complain more.
I haven’t watched the defunctland video since Genie+ actually came out (his fastpass video came out before the release of genie+, maybe there is a new one as well?). But based on other resources (I.e- touring plans and my own observations) I think there is absolutely a larger merge ratio than fastpass had. They have more at stake, when people are paying for the service they expect more.
And Tom- you’re right, it’s not a middle class/wealthy thing, I shouldn’t have phrased it that way because it doesn’t actually portray the problem.
I agree, I think the overselling of G+and LL is contributing to the excessive standby wait times. We did the AK River cruise a few weeks ago, it had a posted 45 minute wait time and the end of the line was just under the covered patio area. It came to a near stand still and we ended up being in line for 1 hour and 45 minutes. Meanwhile there were probably 75+ people sailing through the LL and G+ line at the same time. Those G+ and LL time slots were definitely oversold. But this past Thursday we went again to AK, after having dinner at Rainforest (I know, Nomad is the “it” place to go, but little one loves the theming of Rainforest) and headed over to River Cruise afterwards. It was 5 minutes to closing and the LL and G+ lines were either closed or no appointments cause it was roped off. The posted wait time was 55 minutes and the end of the line was right at the covered patio once again. We got in line and it was constantly moving and sailing through. 24 minutes later we were happily through the line and ride and it was a good feeling. That made us feel like it was worth it and we were happy. Cheers to the happiest place on earth!
It certainly doesn’t feel like the same ratio as Fast pass. That felt more like a true “zipper” merge situation . Even using round numbers, a $30 up charge on a $150 ticket is 20%. The advantage should be that for 20% extra you wait in a much SHORTER line than standby., not that the standby line comes to a complete stop until every genie and DAS guest clears the line. Disney has created a circular problem. The more genie/DAS guests, the longer the standby line. As standby times increase, more guests pursue genie or DAS and the circle continues.