Skyliner Gondola Update: October 2018
As we continue on with our Walt Disney World construction updates, we take a look at progress on the Skyliner gondola stations at Hollywood Studios, Epcot, Caribbean Beach, and Riviera Resort. The Disney Skyliner will connect these parks to these resort hotels, plus Pop Century and Art of Animation. In addition to the construction photos, we’ll have some commentary about the latest Skyliner rumors.
While we will discuss some rumors about the Skyliner in this post, only very basic details have been released thus far by Disney, and the bulk of those are in our Skyliner Announced for Walt Disney World post from the D23 Expo. For our thoughts on the impact to sightlines around Walt Disney World, see our Summer Skyliner Construction Update.
Many Walt Disney World fans seem puzzled by how these gondolas will (or not) work, and if you’d like background about our experiences with other real-world gondola systems (including ones by the same manufacturer as the Skyliner), start reading about one-third of the way through our original Disney Skyliner Rumor post. Obviously, the rumor portion of that post is way outdated, but the background about gondolas remains accurate.
Let’s start with the latest rumor about the Disney Skyliner, which is that the gondolas will not have air-conditioning. This caused a minor degree of outrage, as we already know the gondolas will be enclosed. There’s thus the potential for the interiors to be hot, especially in the heart of summers in Florida. Some took that a step further, proclaiming that these would be deadly heat boxes, torturous slow-cookers, and other less hyperbolic assessments.
Perhaps I’m being blinded by my enthusiasm for the Skyliner, but I think it’s premature to sound the doom and gloom drums here. The gondolas will be ventilated and move at a speed of around 11 mph, which alone would provide decent air circulation.
Then there are the other unknown variables. How will the exterior be glazed to reduce heat absorption? Will there be powered fans or an active air circulation system inside? What other measures will be taken to ensure guest comfort?
Personally, I’m not concerned about the lack of air-conditioning. I don’t think we’ve ever used a gondola or cable car with air-conditioning, which is obviously not an issue in mountain regions like Switzerland. In places like Hong Kong and Japan, it’s a different story.
The 20+ minute Ngong Ping 360 Cable Car in Hong Kong only has air ventilation, and Hong Kong’s summer humidity makes Florida feel like a breezy winter day. If Hong Kong doesn’t have issues with a significantly longer ride in subtropical climate, I don’t think gondolas in Central Florida will be an issue.
It seems to me that some Walt Disney World fans made up their minds long ago that the Skyliner is “bad” and now they’re going to latch onto any information they can to validate their positions. At least the sightline ‘controversy’ is grounded in logical premises (even if I disagree with it).
This latest controversy treats gondolas as some huge unknown, a scenario of Disney reinventing the wheel. The reality is that transportation systems just like this already exist around the world, including places like Venezuela, Singapore, Colombia, Greece, and so on. The real-world implementation of gondolas has occurred in places far more “challenging” than Walt Disney World; they are very much a known quantity.
To assume the Disney Skyliner will be a failure because of lightning, heat, ventilation, load times, or some other random potential operating issue requires willfully ignoring the countless instances of these transportation systems operating without issue around the world. They might be uncommon in the United States outside of ski resorts (at least for now–urban planners are catching up), but the world is a big place and gondolas just like these exist all over it.
Anyway, on with the Disney Skyliner station construction photos…
First up is the Epcot station at the International Gateway. From my perspective, the exterior design of this station is the biggest concern about the project, as it’s a stark contrast to the Parisian architecture surrounding it at International Gateway.
This is true both in person and in concept art, so at this point, I wouldn’t expect a change. Hopefully the station is sufficiently isolated from International Gateway’s buildings with foliage, at least.
Next, Disney’s Hollywood Studios:
This is the station we see most, as it’s plainly visible from the main entrance to Disney’s Hollywood Studios.
In addition to work progressing nicely on the station, the line of support pillars is also visible on the long walk from the temporary bus drop-off:
These pillars are all over the place in the Epcot and Disney’s Hollywood Studios area. It’s really something to see as you ride around in a bus or car–they really dot the landscape.
It’s going to be such a shame when they all have to be ripped up after the Skyliner is a colossal failure because no one thought to air condition it.
Next, we walk over to the parking lot of Disney’s BoardWalk Inn, where the turn is nearing completion.
As a reminder, here’s what that looks like on the route map:
This turn is basically what preserves sightlines in World Showcase. If the Epcot to Riviera line connected as the crow flies, there would be gondolas floating over Morocco and Japan.
Whether they are visible behind France still remains to be seen, and at least in part depends upon the design of the France pavilion expansion.
Above is the Riviera Resort station.
We’ve noticed that there’s some confusion about whether this will be accessible for Caribbean Beach guests, as “rumors” suggest Walt Disney World wants to isolate the Riviera Resort, making it difficult to access from Caribbean Beach.
There are air quotes around rumor for a reason; it’s highly unlikely that Disney will force guests in Aruba or Martinique to wanting to visit Epcot to walk all the way to the Caribbean Beach station and then transfer at Riviera.
Finally, the massive station at Caribbean Beach. This will be the largest of the gondola stations, and handle the most traffic.
The design here looks promising. I especially like the tower rising to the left, which will have a cupola mirroring other architecture around Caribbean Beach.
That’s it for this update on the Walt Disney World Skyliner gondola transportation network. We still don’t have any guesses as to when this will officially debut. We think the earliest official grand opening date would be Memorial Day 2019, but it’s also possible that Disney could be aiming for a late fall debut to coincide with the opening of Star Wars: Galaxy’s Edge. It’ll also be interesting to see how the Skyliner is treated in terms of marketing; it’s not an actual ride so it’s unlikely to receive a lot of fanfare in the mainstream press, but we’d expect a fair amount of coverage on the Disney Parks Blog and other outlets aimed at Disney enthusiasts.
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Your Thoughts
What are your thoughts on the Skyliner? Have you already sworn it off for some reason or another? Do you agree or disagree with our perspective? Thoughts on construction progress? Any questions we can help you answer? Hearing your feedback–even when you disagree with us–is both interesting to us and helpful to other readers, so please share your thoughts below in the comments!
PD
Exciting changes and practical as well. Hope to see even greater park / resort coverage in the future. The naysayers will always be in the crowd.
What’s up with all the negative Nellie’s on here??? Gondolas are cool and I’m sure Disney will make them comfortable and efficient. Nobody is forcing you to ride them.
Hello everyone. I agree with you on this. I can’t wait to ride it and hope they do go on to other resorts and maybe to Disney springs. I no far fech but hope.lol
I think Disney should expand the gondolas to link more of the resorts and parks together. While they’re at it they should expand the monorail too.
I’d love to see something similar from AKL to DAK at some point – the bus route takes a little while because it’s not a straight line. But you could build gondolas from the southeast corner of Jambo House straight to the gate, go over the edge of the AKL savannas and be there quickly! The distance is about the same as it will be from the Riviera to International Gateway.
I agree!! We paid BIG BUCKS for DVC membership at Beach Club, and part of the appeal was the second entrance to Epcot, which was sold to us as “a private entrance for those staying at the lake resorts”. Now, WDW is actively providing transportation into our resort area from moderate and value resorts. Not good, Disney!
I believe there has been discussion in the past about Disney’s desire to do away with the terms “Value”, “Moderate” and “Deluxe” resorts. There are two things I see happening soon:
1 — Designations of resort classes to “Standard”, “Skyliner” and “Monorail”.
2 — Increase in rack rates of “Skyliner” resorts by 20 — 40 percent (which if my numbers are correct will pay for the cost of the Skyliner system in 22 months or less, with the bonus, for Disney, of increasing per room margin return by 8 or more percent)
My concern, admittedly a selfish one, is how it will increase the crowd at the world showcase entrance to Epcot. We usually stay at Beach Club/Yacht Club/Boardwalk because we like to walk to Epcot and take advantage of the low volume at this entrance.
I thought about this too, since we usually stay on the crescent as well and love walking in through the showcase entrance… but it’s always so empty on that side of the park that although it will increase the number of people going in through that gate, it still isn’t going to be crowded. How many people can get off a gondola at one time? Now if the gondola held more people in each “oven of death” (LOL), than the Monorail, it would be more concerning to me… but they can’t, so it’s really a no-brainer for Disney to use that entrance. They have to keep it staffed all the time, now those staff members will have to work instead of standing around chatting most the day 😉
We are DVC members and our”home”is Boardwalk. They told us how easy it would be to get to Epcot, now I fear that this area will just be as busy as the bus area! I hope that they redesign the entrance way so that MORE people can go thru the entrance. Also when people line up for the boat ride the lines go across the walkway and it is CRAZy! Just another way for Disney to get MORE people into the parks and more money for staying at a resort. BUILD ANOTHER PARK!!!!
I was at Boardwalk in Aug and saw the construction. I just assumed there would be a station there. I know you can walk/boat to Epcot and DHS already, but i thought having a BW station would bring more guests to the Boardwalk area. The buses make resort to resort travel difficult. oh well, guess i was wrong.
I don’t get the Gondola path Disney is using. No Disney Springs connection, no direct route between Epcot and Hollywood Studios. This seems purely aimed at giving people at the 4 connected resorts another option to get to Epcot and HS.
It does not look like this system is intended for general use at all.
“It does not look like this system is intended for general use at all.”
It’s definitely not. A connection at Disney Springs would bring in an influx of people from off-site trying to bypass parking charges, or using it as a form of free entertainment.
The system is aimed at reducing the burden on buses at 3 of Walt Disney World’s largest resorts. I wouldn’t be surprised to see future expansion to Coronado Springs, but other resorts/destinations seem unlikely.
Right, and with an hourly capacity of <5,000 people per hour it can't be a general use transportation. I remain curious what it will do to prices at the connected resorts. There is already a premium for Pop vs. the All Stars, I suspect that difference is going to suddenly get much wider.
The route makes sense in that it gives you a lot of bang for the buck. Those four resorts represent over 20% of the total rooms on property and they are all currently bus only resorts. So connecting 20% of the rooms to 2 of the four parts is a good starting point for a new transportation system. It will take a lot of buses off the road and probably be much cheaper to operate then the equivalent buses would be. As for the Epcot to DHS connection, you can already walk or take the boat so a third direct option really wasn’t needed. With that said, even with the transfer the Skyliner will likely get you from Epcot to DHS faster then the boat would.
I am less concerned about weather and in-cabin climate control and more curious about weather and service in general. I’m most familiar with the Maokong Gondola here in Taipei, which is of French design and similar to the one in Hong Kong. Taiwan is hit with typhoons and heavy rains on the regular, and the gondolas shut down if there are even signs of severe weather. Will Florida’s suffer the same fate? Is it just assumed there will be buses on hand in the event that happens?
I think it depends upon how severe the weather is; I don’t think Taiwan’s storms are entirely comparable to Florida’s afternoon showers. Doppelmayr’s past designs can operate in storms, so that wouldn’t be a problem unless Disney wants to err on the side of caution for some reason.
With that said, Disney has become pretty adept at the whole ‘buses ready to go in the event of downtime’ thing, as that’s a near-daily occurrence with the monorails.
The no air conditioning bothers me to a degree but it’s a first world problem I can get over. Does anyone know the rules on having prams/strollers? It seems like a third of parties had at least one.
And I’d love your opinion on how this will affect Pop and Art and their prices. An over dinner debate had us come to the thought the prices would rise once skyline is open.
I assume these gondolas will be of the detachable variety, meaning they can load from a stationary position providing ample time for strollers, ECVs, etc.
This gondolas will be at the stations moving at 1 mph. Strollers and ECVs will be able to easily load right on to the gondola.
Imagine when at some point the inevitable occurs, the system has an outage, and people are stuck in these with no A/C or cooling fans in the middle of summer. I’d wonder if they’re going to be more reliable than the monorail which seems like there’s at least one or two issues every summer.
The Doppelmayr gondolas are incredibly reliable, so I wouldn’t expect any issues the first several years. The true test will be a decade or two from now: will Disney properly maintain the Skyliner, or will the gondolas have the same problems as the aging monorails?
That’s definitely when problems could arise.
There will be 3 backup systems which include batteries. It would be nearly impossible for these gondolas to be stuck.
I think you’re being too quick to dismiss the implications of “no A/C”.
“Forced air cooling” is not that effective. I have been in gondola systems that use it, and it is not unbearable, but it is also not comfortable. I’m sure you, like me, have delighted at boarding a bus (of all things!) in the summer, and similarly resigned yourself to an overheated boat trip. I don’t see why the gondolas will be any different in being a disappointing form of transportation during summer.
In my humble opinion, this project shouldn’t have even got off the ground (heh) until it was assured that the interiors would be something more comfortable than “not unbearable”. Now, there may be serious challenges with getting an A/C system into an off-the-shelf gondola – which makes the rumour eminently plausible. But if that’s the case, I would respectfully question whether gondolas are truly the right solution for WDW, or if they were green-lit purely because they are a comparatively cheap, quick and effective way to add transport capacity.
I agree with all of your premises, but disagree with the conclusions.
Totally agree that it’ll be like boarding a boat in the summer–disagree that it’s a problem, or even that I’d prefer an air-conditioned bus.
Agree that this gondola system was probably chosen because it’s a comparatively cheap, off-the shelf solution. Disagree that Walt Disney World should’ve made costly modifications (or spent a ton more on monorails) to make them more comfortable.
We’re talking ~3 minute rides here…I guess I think going for something economical and “comfortable enough” trumps perfect and expensive. Plenty of other places around Walt Disney World desperately in need of that money.
I say also… if you don’t want to ride the gondolas… don’t ride them. Tom you said, and I agree because I’ve been there, Hong Kong humidity and heat dwarfs Orlando’s. If people want AC, ride the bus.
In reality, Disney serves their customers the way they see Best. Car dealers build cars that they think serves their customers the best. They do not solicit ideas and if I don’t like the car, I don’t buy it.
We will try the gondolas and if we don’t like them, we won’t ride them. Simple!
What is also “simple” is the notion that people complaining, making reviews, taking action, etc…. is the right of every paying consumer and is completely legitimate. Why can’t someone express concern and negativity about this? Cdd89 wants Disney to do other things with their and our resources. There are many other things people don’t like about the gondolas besides AC. I hate the way Disney is refurbing their resorts and I am sure not going to shut up about it because I want Disney to know that there are some like me that are not happy about it. Cdd89 is doing the same about the gondalas. You say there are other choices for transportation – yes, but what perhaps Cdd89 wants is additional options besides what he sees as a not very well conceived gondola system and a sometimes very slow bus system (my experience).
This gondola system will be state of the art technology. Not off the shelf at all. In fact they are designed to go 17 mph and carry 5,400 people per hour. Although there is only air circulating systems, the gondolas are designed to add AC if necessary.
We are planning a trip late April/early May, and a cast member told us they’re “hopeful” the gondolas will be open by our trip!
I wouldn’t put too much stock in that.
I’m told they will travel at 17 mph (not the 11 mph that you quoted) and will also have air circulation.
Are you sure that’s not 17 kph?
17 mph is what Jim Hill reported in the latest Disney Dish Podcast with Len Testa.
Doppelmayr claims speeds up to 7 m/s (15.7 mph) for the D-line gondolas, which these are believed to be. I guess we’ll see once built. I’m not sure how close actual operation speeds and manufacturer’s top speeds tend to be. Either way, much faster than the Friendship boat speed.
17 kph is approximately 11 mph, so it’s very possible Jim Hill got the units mixed up.
17 mph is correct. If any one wants to hear an expert on these gondola systems, Rob VonRoll is interviewed today on the Resortloop.com podcast today. Great interview.
2 thoughts: By building generic looking stations that gives Disney a reason to put up walls in the future to re-theme each station
Once the gondolas are labelled a failure, instead of ripping out the pillars Disney can leave them up as towers and start their own cell phone company.
LMAO!!
This is going to be so cool when is finished.
I can’t imagine these things being any hotter than the Friendship boats on the inside.
Talked with a cast member on his say he thought it would be Valentine’s day so i don’t see end of fall at least probably early summer more like it
We’re skiers, so I don’t have any concerns about the gondola’s as a transportation concern. I think that most ski resorts are more challenging for installation and maintenance than WDW. And like the monorail I look forward to a different mode of transportation to get to the parks.
My only concern is the theming. Aside from Caribbean Beach, your pictures so far look like WDW is taking Doppelmayr lifts from any ski resort and plopping them down at the park entrances. I realize that this is exactly what they are in fact doing, but I’d like for them to take the effort to make the stations look special.
I should add, that while these are off-the-shelf, this is the first implementation of this model of gondola in North America. That’s pretty cool.
“My only concern is the theming.”
That’s my concern, too. I’m worried that with so many simultaneous projects under construction at Walt Disney World right now, budgets and details will be cut from each one, creating spots where it looks like Disney “cheaped out.” To me, the theming of the gondola stations is a prime example of this.
I’m also not exactly thrilled with some of the paths. Another small turn station could’ve been used to direct the Skyliner behind Caribbean Beach (instead of directly overhead, putting pillars right between buildings) while maintaining the existing gondola station locations. That also seems lazy to me.
You’ve got to hand it to Disney in one regard — by refusing to build aesthetically beneficial turn stations (and thus straightening Skyliner paths) to save money, they have found their most literal way yet to “cut corners”.
This is very exciting, and in alignment with what Walt Disney imagined for Epcot. I cannot wait to ride!